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Hi
Fist of all sorry that i write in english in a french forum, but it is the only forum that i have found where there is a person who might be able to help me with my Sega Gloc power supply.
I have read this tread http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28660.0 abaut restoring a PSU for a sega gloc deluxe - and first of all I am impressed!!!
I hope that "GC339" is readin my post because i would like to ask for his help :) (if possible)
So now to my question - I have also a defective PSU and i have changed some components, but there is a resistor that i am unable to find on ebay.
Its abaut 2 cm long and has legs almost 1mm - The color codes are Red-Red-Gold-Gold
If i type the color codes into a resistor calculator i get 2.2 Ohms 5%
But all the resistors that i have found physically smaller in size.
I do not know the voltage of the resistor, i assume that it sets the size of the resistor?
I have attached a photo of the resistor that I need - then i hope that you can help me identify it.
Also attached a picture of the place where the resistor is located.
And last i with that i where just as smart as "GC339" or that i lived in france and not i denmark
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Resistor:
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170103134727-perjmolsen-Resistor.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170103134727-perjmolsen-Resistor.jpg)
Location:
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170103134802-perjmolsen-Placement-of-resistor.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170103134802-perjmolsen-Placement-of-resistor.jpg)
Components that i have changed:
Transistor:
4xS20LC20u
4XK1250
4XS20LC40
Transistors on pcb (location)
q40
Q9
Q8
Q6
Q11
PC1
IC2
WAITING FOR
TR1
IC1
R24
PCB with changed components
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170103140112-perjmolsen-20170103-135105.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170103140112-perjmolsen-20170103-135105.jpg)
PCB other side
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170103140201-perjmolsen-20170103-135130.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170103140201-perjmolsen-20170103-135130.jpg)
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This resistor is probably a Flameproof Type, 2 or 3W power, 500V
I hope that it can help you ;)
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Hi
Thanks - Ill order some of them :) that shoud be the last compnents that needs replacments
(with my basic skills to identify them)
Then i hope that i have found and replaced all the defective components, so when i turn on the power nothing blows up
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Hi,
don't give up, gc339 has done a fantastic work, thanks to him i was able to repair my pcb.
if i can give you a advice, don't forget to replace your olds 78L15 and 78L05. These little bastards are voltage regulators and i think they were the cause of massive damage on my board... :-\
good luck !
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Hi.
Why do you need to replace R24 ?
Is it cut or burned ?
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Hi,
don't give up, gc339 has done a fantastic work, thanks to him i was able to repair my pcb.
if i can give you a advice, don't forget to replace your olds 78L15 and 78L05. These little bastards are voltage regulators and i think they were the cause of massive damage on my board... :-\
good luck !
Hi
Thanks for the info - I will also order those then and change them just to be sure.
I refuse to give up, and not after that i found the guide from GC339 I hope that i am able to get the one power supply fixed.
Kind regards
Per
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Hi.
Why do you need to replace R24 ?
Is it cut or burned ?
Hi GC339
First of all - Thanks for your guide :)
I hope that i have the skills to get the PSU fixed.
Ill do my best :)
The reson that i change the R24 is that i am unable to messure any resistance in the transistor i get OL at the multimeter in Ohms test, then i think is broken.
Kind Regards
Per
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According to the body color of this resistor, I think like Fred G5 that it must be a flame-proof resistor.
Although it's better, but it's not an absolute necessity to replace it with a resistor of the same type.
An ordinary resistor, power 2 or 3 watts, should be suitable. You can also try a wire-wound resistor, power 5 ou 7 watts.
If this resistor is cut, it must have acted as a fuse and transistor Q1 is probably short-circuited. Check it and pay attention to L2, some windings of its coils could also be short-circuited.
PS : Data about the windings of L2 are written on this draft : http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28406.msg453306#msg453306
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According to the body color of this resistor, I think like Fred G5 that it must be a flame-proof resistor.
Although it's better, but it's not an absolute necessity to replace it with a resistor of the same type.
An ordinary resistor, power 2 or 3 watts, should be suitable. You can also try a wire-wound resistor, power 5 ou 7 watts.
If this resistor is cut, it must have acted as a fuse and transistor Q1 is probably short-circuited. Check it and pay attention to L2, some windings of its coils could also be short-circuited.
PS : Data about the windings of L2 are written on this draft : http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28406.msg453306#msg453306
Hi
Thanks so moutch for all your help :)
Hmm.. I am unable to find the Q1, can you point me in the right direction on the PCB?
Ill try to see if i can figure out how to test if the L2 is short-circuited
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Q1 is the transistor on the heatsink, just at right of the red circle.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170103134802-perjmolsen-Placement-of-resistor.jpg)
To check L2, you must measure the resistance and the inductance of each winding (refer to the values I wrote on the draft (http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28406.msg453306#msg453306)) and then check insulation between coils which must be infinite.
This kind of tool (chinese sellers on eBay) will be helpfull to measure both inductance and resistance of any coil.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20160413000511-gc339--57-1-.JPG)
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Oh that one thanks :)
I already have that tool, i did not know that i coud use it to test coils also :)
Thanks again :)
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Hi
Just a another question ;)
The resistors at location:
R81 and R63 seems to be a 22 ohms 5% (Red-Red-Black-Gold)in my defective PSU
My working PSU that i have 55 ohms 5%(Green-Green-Black- Gold)
So what type of resistor is correct? I have searched for a 55ohms resistors online but only able to find 56 ohms resistors at ebay.
A last question - when replacing resistors, does it matter if it a four or five band resistor? As log as the ohms is the same - then the tolerance is smaller at five band.
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Hi
Some parts just arrived from china ... BUT not the ones that i have ordered.
I need to replace the TR1 - as in the guide i had ordered M8GZ47 from china.. BUT recived M8GZ46 (10 of them)
Would that be fine as TR1 replacement?
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The resistors at location:
R81 and R63 seems to be a 22 ohms 5% (Red-Red-Black-Gold)in my defective PSU
My working PSU that i have 55 ohms 5%(Green-Green-Black- Gold)
Are you sure R63 is the right reference ? Is not it rather R69 ?
The value of these resistors depends on the release of the motor driver board, this is 22 Ω for the reference 400-5117 (not suffixed) and 56 Ω for the 200-5117Y ("Y" suffixed).
Take a look at the first tab of this chart (OpenOffice Calc File) : http://www.gamoover.net/gc339/SEGA/Nomenclature.ods
My working PSU that i have 55 ohms 5%(Green-Green-Black- Gold)
So what type of resistor is correct? I have searched for a 55ohms resistors online but only able to find 56 ohms resistors at ebay.
A 5% tolerance implies that this resistor may not have a value other than one of the E24 series (http://www.logwell.com/tech/components/resistor_values.html), so 56 is the right value.
The second green ring is probably due to a momentary lack of blue paint during manufacturing. Have you measured the value of these resistors?
A last question - when replacing resistors, does it matter if it a four or five band resistor? As log as the ohms is the same - then the tolerance is smaller at five band.
You case use resistors with a better tolerance than 5%. Some values of the E48 or E96 series do not exactly fit those of the E24 series so it's necessary to choose the nearest value or at least one within the ± 5% range.
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Are you sure R63 is the right reference ? Is not it rather R69 ?
The value of these resistors depends on the release of the motor driver board, this is 22 Ω for the reference 400-5117 (not suffixed) and 56 Ω for the 200-5117Y ("Y" suffixed).
Take a look at the first tab of this chart (OpenOffice Calc File) : http://www.gamoover.net/gc339/SEGA/Nomenclature.ods
A 5% tolerance implies that this resistor may not have a value other than one of the E24 series (http://www.logwell.com/tech/components/resistor_values.html), so 56 is the right value.
The second green ring is probably due to a momentary lack of blue paint during manufacturing. Have you measured the value of these resistors?
You case use resistors with a better tolerance than 5%. Some values of the E48 or E96 series do not exactly fit those of the E24 series so it's necessary to choose the nearest value or at least one within the ± 5% range.
Oh i did not know that there where differences between the boards and som of the components =?=
Ill check up on the components that i have changed matches the correct value on the boards.
A quick look in the chart and compareing with the components, it seems that the defective board is the SEGA 400-5117 - and my working board is SEGA 400-5117Y.
Again thanks for your help, and also the component chart ^-
I just need to figure out if the M8GZ46 can be used in TR1
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Again thanks for your help, and also the component chart
All the links (components chart, schematic draft..) I gave do not come out of nowhere, they aren't hidden and are included inside the two main threads about these motor driver boards :
- http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28406.0, beginning at message #61 (page 4)
- http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28660.0
I just need to figure out if the M8GZ46 can be used in TR1
Coming soon...
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Hi
Regarding the TR1 - I have mixed it up with another part ...
The replacement for TR1 is BT138-600E (mentioned here http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28660.80)
The part i also have ordered on ebay, but not yet recived
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Hi
Just an small update - just comment / correct me if i am missing something :)
1. I am still waiting for the "R24" resistor to arrive from china. :-\
I have also tested the old resistor in my "china component tester" it reeds as 2.6ohms, a bit high i think? so i do want to solder it in again. So i have not yet tested the "L2" transformer. - do you think i need to when the resistor seems to be fine?
("Q1" also seems to be fine - i have compared it with a new K1535 in my tester and they reeads the same values)
2. I have changed all the 78L15 and 78L05 with some new ones - i tested the old one's in my tester, and they gave different results, so i think that it where good that i replaced them. ^-
3. Replaced some of the Ceramic Disc Capacitor's (104) - 25V, they looked burned but when i tested them they tested OK, but changed them anyway.
4. Changed TR1 to a BT138-600E
5. Changed IC1
6. My board is the SEGA 400-5117 the D20,D22,D24,D26 is according to the component chart S20LCA20, but i am only able to find S20LC20U. Does it matter? are the two comonents not identical?
.. So i hope i am ready to power it on when i receive the R24 resistor... and hopefully no smoke.. i pray that the powersupply works ^-^
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Hi
Latest update... i have now turned on the power.. but no 12V or 5 Volt are present. :'(
I have removed the solder bridge and de-solder the L2 transformer, and i am trying to understand the diagram here http://hico-srv004.pixhotel.fr/sites/default/files/gamoovernet/20130822135915-gc339-ConverBT.GIF
How do i find leg one?
The L2 transformer has 12 legs in total - where is leg one?
I have attached a picture og the transformer:
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170122150359-perjmolsen-20170122-145852.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170122150359-perjmolsen-20170122-145852.jpg)
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Hi
I if test the L2 this way i get 65PF... is that corect?
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170122151445-perjmolsen-20170122-151239.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170122151445-perjmolsen-20170122-151239.jpg)
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Hi
I figured out how to find the corect legs at L2 and messure the coils.. hint.. look at the schematics ^-^
If i use my china tester i get some funny results? (25-25pF between eatch coils).. i guess that it is the tester who is to cheap :)
If i messure the Ohms with my multimeter i get followig messurements:
1-6 = 0.4 ohm
2-5 = OL
3-5 =0.4 ohm
3-4 = 5.3 ohm
7-8= 0.6 ohm
10-11 0.5 ohm
13-14 0.5 ohm
So no coils are dead, is that correct... then why do i not have 12V or 5V... :'(
I have removed the solder bridge.
Can it be one of the D20-D26 who are defect? can it trigger a shutdown of 12V
Im a bit stuck... i hope someone can give me a hint.. (GC339 maybee) :)
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Sorry, I missed the last messages.
Pin 1 is indicated by the truncated (or rounded) corner. Then you need to count the pins clockwise when you look at the bottom of the item or in a counterclockwise direction if you look at it from its top. Free places (not equipped with pins) must also be numbered for the count to be right.
F and S wires are those which are directly soldered on the printed circuit.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170123111437-gc339-L2.PNG) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170123111437-gc339-L2.PNG)
The resistance of the windings seems a bit too high regarding the one I measured, it seems you failed to take in account the additional resistance inserted by the ohmmeter wires.
This kind of tester you use should be able to measure inductances, please check this ability on the Chinese seller's advertisement.
The display of a winding check should look like this :
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170123121143-gc339-Inductor.PNG) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170123121143-gc339-Inductor.PNG)
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Hi GC339 ;)
My tester can messure inductances (according to seller)
It seems that it is the wire+aligator clip who is causing my tester to mailfunction...constant get (25 pF) if i test a component directly in the tester it testes fine.. if i test the same component with the extention wire, then it fails. >:D ( I just have removed the plactic cover over the aligator clip and the solder where cold..dammit! why did i not think of that before!) I just made a new wire and soldered the aligator clip on and now i can read with wires
Dammit and i have just solder the L2 transformer back in the PCB.. >:D and i guess i need to test it outsite pcb.. then there is no other option thant to de solder it one more time
Is there a way that i can check that there is power to the L2 transformer... i think if i have missed a dead component before the L2 transformer...maybe a component is causing it not to get powered..
Thanks again for your help.. ^-
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Hi Gc339
If i need to check that there is power to the L2 transformer - is it then possible to measure it at points marked below?
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170124102625-perjmolsen-power-into-L2.PNG) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170124102625-perjmolsen-power-into-L2.PNG)
I guess that there need to be 220V at the test points?
(sorry for the maybe dumb questions, but i am trying to learn as i go forward) ;)
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Firstly, it is not advisable to do these measurements with the PCB connected directly to the mains. It's safer for you to supply it through an isolation transformer.
Then remove the solder jumper to disconnect the four power VMOS of the H bridge, as I did at 1ère Etape
At the indicated test points you must measure a DC voltage of 310V (220Vac × √2).
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Then remove the solder jumper to disconnect the four power VMOS of the H bridge, as I did at 1ère Etape
I have removed the solder jumper ^-
At the indicated test points you must measure a DC voltage of 310V (220Vac × √2).
[/quote]
Just to be completly sure, the test points are those i have marked with the red circle here:?
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170124102625-perjmolsen-power-into-L2.PNG) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170124102625-perjmolsen-power-into-L2.PNG)
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Godafternoon :)
I have made som tests today, to figure out why i do not have 12V or 5V
1. If I made a diode test with my multimeter at the bridge rectifier mountet in circut i get the following:
Positive test lead at + and negative on "wavy lines" i get 05.30ohm - if i reverse that OL, seems OK?
Positive test lead at + and negative on - i get 10.08 ohm - if i reverse that OL, - thats a bit high is that correct? i think its caused because it is messured in circut.
2. If i messure the voltage at the bridge rectifier, with leads connected to + and - i get 248,9V DC - Thats quite low? is not? it shoud be 310V - so it might be the cap's at C8 and C9 who is bad?
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170126211411-perjmolsen-Volt-at-bridge.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170126211411-perjmolsen-Volt-at-bridge.jpg)
3. If i test the C8 and C9 (in circut) i get 818 uf.
UPDATED: I have de-solder the C8 and C9 and messure them 806 uF ESR=0.01 ohm and 828 Uf and ESR=0.02 ohm
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170126220457-perjmolsen-Cap.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170126220457-perjmolsen-Cap.jpg)
Can it be the low voltage it is causing the 12V and 5V not to be present?
4. I allready have som new 1000Uf 200V caps, if i messurfe them (out of circut) i get 894 uF.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170126213917-perjmolsen-new-cap.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170126213917-perjmolsen-new-cap.jpg)
I think, and hope, if i change the C8 and C9 the voltage will rise to 310V and the 12V would be present, or am i at the wrong track?
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"Good" afternoon again....
So now i soldered the two new caps in... but still only 243.6V messured at + and - at the bridge rectifier. :bail:
What am i doing wrong.. nearly crying.. i have hoped that i have had 340V and also 12V at this point...
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170126223256-perjmolsen-new-cap-mounted.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170126223256-perjmolsen-new-cap-mounted.jpg)
Is my new "china" caps bad also? i have messured them at 894 Uf ESR=0.04 ohm
A nightmare.. but i refuse to give up.. but i need help again :)
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If i messure the voltage at the bridge rectifier, with leads connected to + and - i get 248,9V DC - Thats quite low? is not? it shoud be 310V - so it might be the cap's at C8 and C9 who is bad?
≈249VDC measured between the outputs "+" & "−" of the bridge rectifier would mean 176VAC between the inputs "~" of this bridge. Are you sure your mains voltage is OK? Have you measured it?
For exemple, here at home in France, the mains voltage is about 240 VAC and the rectified voltage sets around 340 VDC.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170126225205-gc339-PwrSupply.PNG) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170126225205-gc339-PwrSupply.PNG)
Are you sure R1 & R2 are OK ?
Is the DC voltage at the terminals of C8 equal to that at the terminals of C9?
Are these also equal to half the voltage at the output of the rectifier even if you only measure 249VDC?
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Hi GC339 :D
Thanks for your reply :-)=
1. The mains voltage coming out of the socket here in Denmark is abaut 230V AC.
I will check the voltage at the "wavy lines" on bridge rectifier and let you know what that measures.
2. I have not checked the R1 and R2
I will de solder them and measure them and let you know the result
3. I will also try to measure the voltage between the C8 and C9 terminals and let you know.
A huge thanks one more time - now i have some steps to preform and get a bit closer ^-
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Hi
Just an update.
Regarding the R1 and R2 resistors - I have de solder them and they are dead! - so you naild it GC339 ^-
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170127165346-perjmolsen-R1-R2.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170127165346-perjmolsen-R1-R2.jpg)
I just have ordered 5pcs of 5W 1.2 Ohm at ebay
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/162137410017?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&var=461108678563&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Hopefully they will arrive soon :)
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It's rather strange these two resistors were cut at the same time.
They are only involved each time the power is switched ON just to limit current through capacitors C8 & C9, they are then short-circuited by TR1 in established and steady operation.
The plausible explanation is that TR1 cut itself first, so they had to undergo all the load to finally burn themselves.
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Hi
Yes its strange, but i think you explanation is corect - its so exiting to get the new resistors and mount them :-)=
I have ordered them in UK this time, so hopefully i get them at the end of next week. ^-
If i had placed an order in china i'll have to wait a month before i get them and the diffrence where that i coud get 15 resistores instad of 5 for the same price - but i only need 2 for this project.
(I have two more powersupplys for the g-loc who also are dead, but i only need this one to work them i have two working for my G-loc)
Kind regards
Per
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When I must order from a Chinese seller, I prefer those based in Hong-Kong rather than mainland China because the items usually arrive home in less than two weeks.
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Hi and good evening.. :)
So now finally the new transistors for R1 and R2 arrived.
I have soldered them in, now i got 320 DC Volt ^- a step in the right direction at last .
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170202221632-perjmolsen-new-R1-and-R2.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170202221632-perjmolsen-new-R1-and-R2.jpg)
BUT still no 12V or 5V present... dammit! >:D
Have i overlooked something...?
- Must i de-solder the L2 transformer one more time and test it now i have fixed my tester.. or is there some other component.
HELP! :)
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Here is the schematic of the low voltage power supply :
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20130822135915-gc339-ConverBT.GIF) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20130822135915-gc339-ConverBT.GIF)
Q1 & L2 are the main parts of a blocking oscillator :
- Winding 3-4 is the main primary winding of L2.
- Winding 1-6 is the feedback winding, used to drive Q1 gate and make it oscillate.
- Q2 is used to protect Q1 against :
- Driving overvoltage (ZD2).
- Drain/source overcurrent (R24 voltage).
- Windings 3-5, 7-8, 10-11, 12-13 and F-S are secondary windings, used to produce the low-voltage auxiliary DC supplies.
- The stability of the low-voltage auxiliary supplies is tributary of the +12 volts supply regulation provided via the DC feedback loop (optocoupler PC1 & shunt regulator IC3).
So, it's necessary to first check involved components in the blocking oscillator : transistors (Q1 &Q2), diodes (D4 ... D6, ZD1 & ZD2), resistors, capacitors...
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Hi GC339
Sorry for the late answer to your post.
I do not know if it helps, I have tried to measure if there is any volt present at the input of the L2 transformer. (I guess that's the input)
I have messured 0V at the two marked test points below at the back at the PCB.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170207202434-perjmolsen-L2-back-Ink-LI.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170207202434-perjmolsen-L2-back-Ink-LI.jpg)
And so far i have tested:
Q1 = Checks OK
Q2 = Checks OK
D4 = Checks OK (0.470 ohm one way and OL other way)
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I have tried to measure if there is any volt present at the input of the L2 transformer.
To check voltage at the primary of L2, it's better to measure it between one of the two lite-blue surrounded points and one leg of R4. (are you sure R4 is OK?)
It's possible the DC/DC converter can't start due to a short circuit or an overload in an auxiliary supply. This possibility can be eliminated by desoldering one leg of diodes D1, D3, D9 and D10 (D8 must remain in place because the +12 volts is mandatory for voltage control to work).
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HI :D
Regarding the R4 - i previously have replaced it with a new resistor, so i shroud be OK - but ill de-solder it and test it, just to be sure :)
I'll also try to test test input of the L2 by leg of R4 and one of the blue marked points and let you know what reading i get.
And also try the de-solder one leg of D1,D3,D9 and D10. to see if thats give me 12V
Thanks again :)
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To check voltage at the primary of L2, it's better to measure it between one of the two lite-blue surrounded points and one leg of R4. (are you sure R4 is OK?)
Sorry, I was not careful enough and I made a mistake, it's R24 and not R4. So you must read :
To check voltage at the primary of L2, it's better to measure it between one of the two lite-blue surrounded points and one leg of R24 (are you sure R24 is OK?)
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HI
OK, thats funny.. when i looked at the items i had changed.. I looked at R24 and not R4, and where also planning to check R24 :)
But anyway.. ill check it, thanks for the update :)
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Hi GC339
Just a quick update :D
I have measured between R24 and both of the blue circled test-points.
I have 328V in to the L2 transformer. ^-
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170208211850-perjmolsen-L2power-in.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170208211850-perjmolsen-L2power-in.jpg)
I have to go to work early tomorrow,so no more testing tonight...but tomorow i will test R24 and de solder one leg of D1,D3,D9 and D10. to see if thats give me 12V
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Can you try with the other leg of R24 ?
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HI
I just tested with the other leg of R24 - also 328V present at both the blue circled marked test points.
Then the R24 might be good? it is also brand new :)
I have to try out the de soldering of one leg of D1,D3,D9 and D10. to see if thats give me 12V - then take it from there i guess..
Kind Regards
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I just tested with the other leg of R24 - also 328V present at both the blue circled marked test points.
Then the R24 might be good? it is also brand new
With this last measurement I am quite sure R24 is OK.
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Hi
Just a quick question, regarding the de soldering..
The D1 diode, thats the bridge rectifier, are you sure that one of them i need to de-solder? if i de-solder one leg, will i not loose the power? i case witch leg?
I have de-soldered the following diodes at tested them in the china tester
D9 Tests as diode uf=575mv c=12pf
D10 Tests as diode uf= 580mv c= 11pf
D3 Tests as diode uf=585mv c=15pf
With the D9,D10 and D3 de solder still no 12V at fan outlet - but i gess that might be due to D1.. but i am not sure witch leg to de solder.
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Sorry again, I forgot to postpone the second digit "1" when I drew the draft of the DC/DC converter (summer 2013), so it's D11 and not
D1
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170209200426-gc339-Draft.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170209200426-gc339-Draft.jpg)
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HI G339
No problem :)
I have de-soldred the D11 also - and messured it too, it reads in tester: diode Uf=581 mv c=11pf
switched power on at the pcb, and put the test probes at the fan outlet,no 12V present :(
I have double checked the Q1 a K1535 it checks OK in the tester:
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170209212801-perjmolsen-K1535.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170209212801-perjmolsen-K1535.jpg)
Also checked the Q2 a C1627A .. but in the component cart is ony a C1627..no "A" DO I have put in the wrong component..? when i check it:
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170209212944-perjmolsen-C1627A.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170209212944-perjmolsen-C1627A.jpg)
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Have you checked all the components inside the blue-sky layout ?
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170209215348-gc339-Draft.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170209215348-gc339-Draft.jpg)
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Hi GC339
No i have not yet tested them all - I will have the components de-soldred to night and test them in my china tester :)
I will let you know the result :)
Kind regards
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Hi Gc339
Sorry for the delay but I did not have any spare time this weekend to test the components.
But now i have tested the components and there might be two who is defective
D5 - I have tested the diode in citcut and i get 0000V (in diode mode test - both ways), if i test in conecticvity i get a short.
ZD1 - the same result, if i test in circut i get 0000V (in diode mode test - both ways) if i test in conecticvity i get a short.
If i am correct the D5 and ZD1 is defective, correct? - if so i need to figure out where to get that componets on ebay..
If i look D5 up in your chart it is a S118? what is that? :)
And ZD1 is 13Z, how to find them?
The ZD1 is this the one? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121782360886?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Note..As a diode reference in circut i have also tested D6+D7 also in citcut i get 0,514V when black test lead to black on diode, and OL the other way - so thats reads correct.
All the other tested components reads OK according to your component chart (tested out of circut in china tester)
R25= 10,24k
R23=179,8k
C15= 10,4 uf esr=170ohm
R22=46,5k
R28=4,7
R28=2,4
R26= No component
R24= 220
R21a= 69,9
R21b=68,7
Zd2= Diode uf=719mv C028pf
D6= Black test lead on black stripe on component - 0,514v - reverse leads OL
D7= Black test lead on black stripe on component - 0,514v - reverse leads OL
D5= Short (tested in Circut)
Zd1= Short (tested in circut)
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I had the same issue with somes S118 witch were on the PWM side of the board.
gc339 told me:
"Ca y est, selon la norme japonaise JIS, c'est une diode de signal avec préfixe "1S" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JIS_semiconductor_designation)
c'est donc une 1SS118 Hitachi. Datasheet : http://pdf.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets2/17/17939_1.pdf
Une 1N4148 devrait faire l'affaire quoique l'intensité admissible par cette dernière soit moindre."
Hope he can confirm you this ;)
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Yes, S118 is the shortcut for the japanese reference Hitachi 1SS118 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JIS_semiconductor_designation)
About the 13Z diode, sure it's a zener diode but the suffix is unknown. So I am unable to certify it's a 13 volts item, for example it exists the 1SZ13 diode which is a 36 volts zener!
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HI
Thanks for claifying the items.
The D5, the 1SS118 I have orderd some on ebay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/182455364389?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT - then i jusy need to wait
Regarding the ZD1, 13Z - if i order some of theese 13V here.. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121782360886?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
If i check a 16Y zener (as referenze) in this catalog it's a 16V zener.. so i think but i am not sure that a 13Z is a 13V?
https://www.sos.sk/pdf/SMD_Catalog.pdf
And if they are the wrong one's would they burn up if it is the wrong component?
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The best way to know the zener voltage of diode 13Z is to measure it on the other diode 13Z (ZD02) which is normally OK.
Here is a simple checker schematic. It should be suitable for measuring a zener up to 15 volts, otherwise it will require a voltage source higher than the two 9 volts batteries.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170215185413-gc339-Zener-diode-voltage-test.png) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170215185413-gc339-Zener-diode-voltage-test.png)
Here another measure which unfortunately requires a more sophisticated apparatus : http://jestineyong.com/how-to-measure-the-voltage-rating-of-a-zener-diode/
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Hi Gc339
I have now tested the ZD02 as in the diagram abowe.
I have 17,18V in my to batterys.
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170215210057-perjmolsen-zener-test-zd02.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170215210057-perjmolsen-zener-test-zd02.jpg)
And when the Zener diode is connected it drops to 14,1V
So it must be a 13V Zener.. i do do not seems to find any 14V zener diode on ebay?
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This ones maybe?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121782360886?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
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Zener diodes have a certain accuracy and the 14 volts you measured are always within the tolerance range of 10% of the expected 13 volts.
So 13 volts is the right value (E24 serie) and 0,5 watt of max power should be OK.
The diodes of the link you gave do not have a manufacturer reference and this is a bit disturbing. It will be advised to measure them with the checker before soldering.
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Hi
I have now recived Zenner diodes and tested one
The "ZD1" / 13V zenner diode tests as 14,8V
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170222203810-perjmolsen-Zenner.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170222203810-perjmolsen-Zenner.jpg)
Also recived the part for "D5" some 1N4148
So now time to solder them in and see if there is 12V
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Well...
I soldered the "ZD1" zenner diode in, and also D5
The diodes D9,D10,D3 and D11 where still not soldered in.
Then i turned on the power and 12V at the FAN outlet :-)= :-)=
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170223211201-perjmolsen-12V-yayy.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170223211201-perjmolsen-12V-yayy.jpg)
The i soldered the D9,D10,D3 and D11 in - and turned on the power
12V still at FAN outlet... and the suddenly BANG and i lost the power in my room..and a smell.. FUCK!
I think that the L2 now is dead... is smells bad... Dammit! so close then back to start, and now i might be unable to fix it...
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A picture of the damaged arera... i am unable to upload the smell...
so so sad....
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170223211650-perjmolsen-Smell.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170223211650-perjmolsen-Smell.jpg)
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Hi Again...
I have found the reason why it blow up... When soldered the D3 diode in i have turned it the wrong way!
I always check my work.. but this time overlooked one with fatal consequences...
FUCK! >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D
I have another Power supply laying who also is dead... i might be able to salvage the L2 transformer from this and turn around the D3 diode BEFORE applying voltage...
But i wonder if there might has been more damage to this, so it might be a bad idea..
What are GC339 verdict? :)
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Hi
Well.. i have testet the L2 transformer from the other PCB who where defective, and it seems that is is defective also..
The picture below shows my tests with my multimeter.
The one labeld "New salvage" is the transformer from my salvage PCB, and the other named "old" is the one that i blew up by turning the D3 diode the wrong way.. note I have also de soldred the D3 diode, it there broken i half..
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170305100502-perjmolsen-l2-salvage-test.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170305100502-perjmolsen-l2-salvage-test.jpg)
So i think that where the final nail, not to get my Sega Gloc up and running :'(
I am unable to find any transformers named PQ2016 on the web.. I have only found them on two pages, but they do not respond to my emails.
BUT!
2 chance in getting my gloc up and running
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170305103235-perjmolsen-2-chance-psu.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170305103235-perjmolsen-2-chance-psu.jpg)
I have a third and final PCB, the one i have been working on also.
I have managed to get the 12V and 5V present ^-,
But there is no movement when i mount it in my g-loc, and i do not have the tools or the skills to use a oscilloscope, so that i can not test it.
The following steps in the guide is spon on http://www.gamoover.net/Forums/index.php?topic=28660.0
Step2: 12V and 5 Vold is present according to guide
Step3: 7V and 5V is present according to guide
Step4: Input 17V, ZD3 15V, PC7=5V,PC8=5V
Note changed "Q12" before the change of "Q12" there where 15V at PC8 (leg8) -> It may be the reason for the missing movement, that PC8 is dead due to high current?
Step5: test in step "A" is spot on 15V and 5V Step "B" is spot on 15V and 5V
Step6,7,8: Tested the diodes - all checks fine in the china tester according to guide.
Step9: Unable to test, no skills
Step10:Unable to test, no skills
Step11:Unable to test, no skills
Step12: Tested sensor with solder iron and multimeter, it checks out good.
Step13:Unable to test, no skills
Step14:Unable to test, no skills
When i test it in my g-loc (i have one working PSU)
Then the g loc rises one in one side, the side where the woring PSU is mounted, if i run a test and try to power the PSU that i have fixed there is statc on the screen, and i can hear a humm but no motion at all.
So now i am dead in the water, and realy in need of rescue :)
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Hi
Just an update of repairing my 2nd PCB -
I have all the required voltages - but no movement at all when it is mounted in Gloc.
Therefore the problem must be in the control logic part, and having no oscilloscope and do know how to use it - then i have tried to find another way to diagnose the no movement issue.
I have tried to measure the PC910's on the PCB, by measuring ohm,s between the annode (leg2) and cathode (leg3)
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170314100054-perjmolsen-PC910-snip.PNG) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170314100054-perjmolsen-PC910-snip.PNG)
The following PC910,s i am unable to measure any ohms between PC2,PC3,PC4
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170314100156-perjmolsen-PC910-fails-secound-pcb.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170314100156-perjmolsen-PC910-fails-secound-pcb.jpg)
So i have ordered some new from this seller
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10PCS-PC910-DIP8/32407984936.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.1.qwq8KF&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10065_10068_433_434_10136_10137_10138_10060_10062_10056_10055_10054_302_122_10059_10099_10103_10102_10096_10052_10053_10050_10107_10051_10106_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10037_10078_10079_10077_10073_10070_10122_10123_10126_6000000_10124-10037_10077,searchweb201603_7,afswitch_1,ppcSwitch_5,single_sort_0_default&btsid=a1db6fc0-cae5-44ab-ab65-dfbdef414702&algo_expid=ae35951f-36ee-4d26-8c44-48cd8fa1062e-0&algo_pvid=ae35951f-36ee-4d26-8c44-48cd8fa1062e
I hope that brings me closer to movement :)
Do i have overlooked something else? (what says GC339?) ^-
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Hmm... I wonder if GC339 has left the planet :(
I do not hope that my questions has scared him :-[
I need his expert advice :D
Kind regards
Per
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Hi
A small update
Second powersupply(the one where all the volts are OK):
I have changed the three PC910 optocuplers and still bo movement when i mount it in the g-loc. (so i do not think that the old ones where defective at all)
If i make a motor test then there is some static on the screen and a small humm but no movement at all.
I have also changed the two caps at C36 and C18
Does anybody have expirenced the same when they had restored a powersupply?
First powersupply (the one where I burned the L2 transformer):
I have made a deal at a chineese company at alibaba.com, I have send the defective L2 transformer, PC2019 to china and they have made 10 new L2 transformers and shiped them yesterday, only 17 dollars, so hopefully when they arive i can get to work on that powersupply also.
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Hi
Whuu :-)= A GIANT step for me!
I finally got some movement, I have changed ZD6 and ZD7 with some new 16V zener diode (the old ones where shorted)
Now i have movement, but it stays in upright position in that side where i have mounted my repaired powersupply. The other side does self test ok up and then down.
I have checked that the switches are OK - also if i switch the powersupplys the problem moves to the other side.
So there must be something that controls down movement in the powersupply... but where :-\
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YES! AT LAST!!! :-)= :-)=
ZD11 where the reason for the missing down movement! -> It where shorted!
I changed that to a new one, and FINALLY after nearly 3 years without movement IT MOOVES!! ITS ALIVE!!! ^-
Check it out here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/xo8k730kgn03095/Gloc_working_2017mp4.mp4?dl=0
The funny thing is that the power supply that i have rebuild is faster in movement than the other one, but you do not notice it when the game plays, only in test mode.
--
Then i just wait for the Chinese to send me some new L2 transformers.. then i might also be able to rebuild the first power supply where i fried the L2 transformer.. then if i am so lucky i have a repaired spare 8)
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great job ! :) it's really beautiful to see a such amazing cab comming back to life... and your cab looks great! show us more! :p
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Hi
Thanks for the nice words, i will find some pictures of the restoration process,and post them.
If someone also need to replace the L2 transformer on the PCB, then here is the specification for it.
I am waiting for 10 L2 transformers to arrive from china, then i will attack the two last power supplys that i have, hopefuly i can restore them also, now i have a better understanding of that electronics ( I hope) :D or just pure luck
The spec document can be downloaded here https://www.dropbox.com/s/nhiun74mj9whwna/K352%2BPQ20169Y17%20Mingyuda.pdf?dl=0
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Hi,
Thanks for sharing with us your success and your joy ! :)
It's really great to see such a kind of simulator working again ^-^ !
Thanks also for your offer about the extra inductors L2 !
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Thanks - but....
yesterday when i where playing.. suddenly a burning smell
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170426135702-perjmolsen-20170425-191140.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170426135702-perjmolsen-20170425-191140.jpg)
It seems that it is due to a bad connection
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170426135734-perjmolsen-20170425-195225.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170426135734-perjmolsen-20170425-195225.jpg)
But i have no 5V at IC2, leg 8 - I have changed the L7805 at IC1. And there is 7V at D3
All the other volts are present, I have to dig into it...
UPDATE: I think that i have traced it to that the "upper" connection on IC1 at the middle leg is not connected - this is the input from D3... so therefore no 5V output.
Ill keep you updated when i get it fixed :)
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HI
An update - it where just some bad connections, now 5V are present - and i have re tested all the other volts one more time. Tested in the Gloc and everything works :-)=
Hopefully it stays that this time :)
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Whuu..
Just an update
I just had recived the 10 L2 transformers from china :)
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20170509180900-perjmolsen-L2.jpg) (http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics/20170509180900-perjmolsen-L2.jpg)
Now i can get to work restoring my last two powersupplys so if all goes well i have two spares ^-